Bleach Online Forum

Title: Sajin vs Nnoitra [Print this page]

author: nikevst time: 2015-4-1 17:27:41 Title: Sajin vs Nnoitra

Sajin or Nnoitra?
Who of them better, on your opinion, for PVP?

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-2 21:01:29

Fully modded Nnoitra is better then sajin unmodded but both of them being modded sadly is sajin. But it is also personal opinion in the end and what you prefer or need. Nnoitra protects your assaulters with 85% aid rate which could make a massive difference in pvp and sometimes even in pve i can honestly say Nnoitra has turned around fights i should of other wise flat out lost because he stunned someone who hit him or the aid rate just screwed the other guy. Never used sajin so don't have anything else to say besides a bulk of defense.

author: kosmik time: 2015-4-3 14:04:54

modded noits with the stun has won me fights I should never have won, simply put. I've seen a whole team be stunned on the first attack on him, is quite funny.

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-3 16:12:48

But why bother geting noitra, if I may ask. Why not wait for stark at level 100. I know it's sajin or nnoitra. But wouldn't it be wise to wait for stark

author: kosmik time: 2015-4-4 18:17:24

noits aid ability, which stark doesn't have, and 20% chance to stun when being hit mod which is the biggest factor. Being honest, stark really isn't that good unless your using him for ... soul map maybe?

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-5 00:28:00

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-3 16:12
But why bother geting noitra, if I may ask. Why not wait for stark at level 100. I know it's sajin ...

Stark is a strong vanguard yes in terms that he hits everyone and has higher str defense then nnoitra but the fact remains nnoitra brings more to a fight then stark does and brings more then just offence he brings the ability to stun the enemy once he is modded and the aid rate will save you more times then you can count and bring more wins. I'm level 106 and i have both stark and nnoitra, and i still find myself going back and using him to beat people and win fights i can't win with just pure power. Partners with utility's win far more then partners with just power.

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-5 02:16:49

elitegio replied at 2015-4-5 00:28
Stark is a strong vanguard yes in terms that he hits everyone and has higher str defense then nnoi ...

well the top 3 player in arena in my server, all level 100s, all of them use stark. Not one of them went for noitra, and the level 90s, none have noitra.

The number 1 player in arena, he uses stark and he says stark is great, that he's awesome and a really good vanguard. His words convinced players 2 and 3 in arena because both went for stark also.

As for me, I'm level 85, and I use sajin. He's ok. Noitra sounds cool, if I had the silver I'd get him, unfortunately at 90 I plan to get kenpachi.

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-5 12:37:38

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-5 02:16
well the top 3 player in arena in my server, all level 100s, all of them use stark. Not one of th ...

people are also sheep and will follow who ever tells them whatever or convinces them to think whatever. Most people also followed the guide some guy posted on the forums a while back about tavern partners and people have been following that religiously. Not many people actually do their own thing in theses games anymore and just follow the word of someone else in hopes to get stronger instead of making their own strategies up and formation with different partners. One person on my server went shunsui and jushiro with kaname and no one could beat them until they switched over to a control based formation. What i'm saying about this is just because one person has a good strategy doesn't mean you should copy them down right but instead make your own with partners in which you like and be that one black sheep in the masses that doesn't do what everyone else is doing.

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-5 12:53:44

elitegio replied at 2015-4-5 12:37
people are also sheep and will follow who ever tells them whatever or convinces them to think what ...

Very true. In my server, everybody is going for kenpachi. Only one or two persons have grimmjow, and nobody has panthera yet, well to be honest only 3 level 100s in my server. But still, in my server, the 8 level 90s and above, nobody has noitra.

Everybody went for sajin, visord hirako or the level 100s which have stark

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-5 13:39:05

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-5 12:53
Very true. In my server, everybody is going for kenpachi. Only one or two persons have grimmjow, ...

I went for kenpatchi and panthera grimmjow and my damage is far more then with grimm and ikkaku at lest in pve. I use grimm for pvp as well because you know if someone is using stark i stop his healing all together and make him 15% less tanky.

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-5 15:50:52

elitegio replied at 2015-4-5 13:39
I went for kenpatchi and panthera grimmjow and my damage is far more then with grimm and ikkaku at ...

The thing is from 90 to 100 is a long road. Can't be using grimmjow from 90-100. I mean it takes a while to level up to 100. I'm currently 85. I was gonna go for panthera grimmjow, but I figured that it will take a long while to get, so I decided to go instead for kenpachi at level 90. That's my plan, getting kenpachi at level 90. HIm along with ikaku will be my pve team.

Or do you think I should still get grimmjow?

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-5 20:57:38

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-5 15:50
The thing is from 90 to 100 is a long road. Can't be using grimmjow from 90-100. I mean it takes ...

unmodded grim wont preform as well as modded because he's purple partner so its not worth it to get him till your able to get his upgraded

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-6 02:35:07

elitegio replied at 2015-4-5 20:57
unmodded grim wont preform as well as modded because he's purple partner so its not worth it to ge ...

But also if u do get grimmjow late, panthera, he will be at level 65, and it will be tough to level him to my level, which would be around 100 or at least 95ish.

So if I get him now, he won't do much damage, so I might not use him, thus he won't level up, at least not as much.

If I get him when I reach level 100, the trick will be to make him my current level which will be no easy task.Lots and Lots of xp scrolls wil be required, so I think I'll stick with kenpachi

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-6 03:43:55

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-6 02:35
But also if u do get grimmjow late, panthera, he will be at level 65, and it will be tough to leve ...

he doesn't need to be near the same lvl as your main so long as he is able to wear the highest lvl gear for a assaulter you have. He can level himself off ryoka and es easy enough once you get him to panthera. But your going to need to use a lot of epic exp scrolls but it will be worth it since grimm will help you farm more silver faster so you can replace what you used.

author: grimmjowpantera time: 2015-4-6 05:58:46

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-6 02:35
But also if u do get grimmjow late, panthera, he will be at level 65, and it will be tough to leve ...

even if you get him at a late lvl and cant fully lvl him to your lvl he still does ALOT of damage. i personally use him for everything. he is going to be my main Assaulter for a long time. kick ass mother fucker is awesome.

author: grimmjowpantera time: 2015-4-6 06:01:10

elitegio replied at 2015-4-5 20:57
unmodded grim wont preform as well as modded because he's purple partner so its not worth it to ge ...

my purple grimmjow kicks ass. i have beaten alot of people who have 4 stars on kenpachi without grimmjow's mods. and im only a lvl 88 XD grimmjow kicks ass in either of his forms. trust me. if you can get good gear and decent lvl stuff on him he'll do fine.

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-6 12:54:30

elitegio replied at 2015-4-6 03:43
he doesn't need to be near the same lvl as your main so long as he is able to wear the highest lvl ...

So, I should skip kenpachi at level 90 and rather get panthera grimmjow at 100? I know he does a lot of damage, but I'm thinking about all the damage and silver lost by using him (shin grimjow)and not kenpachi from level 90-100.

So what is it then, get grimmjow, skip kenpachi and rather use the silver to upgrade to hogyokai my zampaktou?

Or get kenpachi, and skip grimmjow. I'm thinking of the time I have to do to level up from 90-100. I'm at 85 currently. I use ikkaku, so my other asaulter is gonna be grimmjow or kenpachi, one or the other.

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-6 12:57:45

grimmjowpantera replied at 2015-4-6 06:01
my purple grimmjow kicks ass. i have beaten alot of people who have 4 stars on kenpachi without gr ...

Is grimmjow then better than a mod 3 renji? I'm hesistant because I've fought guys that use grimmjow and they barely do any damage to my vanguard, so that's why I'm so hesitant.

In any case, should I skip kenpachi then? Between kenpachi, ikkaku and grimmjow, one of them has to sit down.

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-6 13:06:27

grimmjowpantera replied at 2015-4-6 06:01
my purple grimmjow kicks ass. i have beaten alot of people who have 4 stars on kenpachi without gr ...

i don't disagree with you purple grimm can kick ass but from what i've experienced ikkaku deals more damage then him. Upgraded grimm is far better.

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-6 13:14:32

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-6 12:57
Is grimmjow then better than a mod 3 renji? I'm hesistant because I've fought guys that use grimm ...

The reason why those grimms did so little damage is because grimm's talent isn't like every other Assaulter partner where its +15% str he instead gets +15% damage rate. The difference being defense takes a flat rate away from str or kido attacks. What this means is someone with low attack but high damage rate will deal less damage to a enemy van that has high defense compaired to another partner who has higher str. Most people don't realize that damage rate is just a attack multiplier that is effected by the amount of defense the other guy has compared to the straight up attack increase which would make your attack higher instead of multiplying it. If the other van has more defense then you do attack you'll only do 3-9 damage no matter what. But upgraded grimm reduced enemy van's defense by 15% which in turn makes everyone stronger. doesn't do much in pve but since pve mobs have really low defense as it is the damage rate will actually do more then the str increase.

author: grimmjowpantera time: 2015-4-6 13:19:45

elitegio replied at 2015-4-6 13:14
The reason why those grimms did so little damage is because grimm's talent isn't like every other ...

you sure? cuz mine does alot of damage more then ikkaku and kenpachi with 3 stars on them. im hold rank 37 in arena in server 1 of the us. and that server is hell. so it all depends on what you give him.

author: grimmjowpantera time: 2015-4-6 13:23:07

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-6 12:57
Is grimmjow then better than a mod 3 renji? I'm hesistant because I've fought guys that use grimm ...

and he is better then 3 star renji.

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-6 13:35:37

grimmjowpantera replied at 2015-4-6 13:19
you sure? cuz mine does alot of damage more then ikkaku and kenpachi with 3 stars on them. im hold ...

i was on server one from day one i know what server 1 is like before i moved on to another server. I could give you a even longer more detailed reply but you'd probably just keep questioning me on it so i'm not going to bother. In short my grimm does as much damage as my kido main and kenpatchi but the moment i throw him into my pvp formation against a real van from the top 20 on my server he goes from doing 90k damage with his normal attack to only going 20k with his normal. Once his skill goes off its another story.

author: grimmjowpantera time: 2015-4-6 13:43:27

elitegio replied at 2015-4-6 13:35
i was on server one from day one i know what server 1 is like before i moved on to another server. ...

weird. he does around more then my main. i guess mine is just super op. XD

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-6 14:15:59

grimmjowpantera replied at 2015-4-6 13:23
and he is better then 3 star renji.

I will trust you. I will get grimmjow. Though that will mean that I will have to skip kenpachi. That's better though because with the silver saved from the janken to do 1500 reishi, I will use that silver for my reiatsu to level it to 40.

So now, my team will be ikkaku, main, grimmjow, kisuke and rukia, 8th skill lvl 20. Is that good?

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-6 14:21:45

elitegio replied at 2015-4-6 13:14
The reason why those grimms did so little damage is because grimm's talent isn't like every other ...

Yeah that is very true. I beat easily people that had grimmjow because my sajin skill increased defense, so they barely scratched me. I'm starting to get grimmjow coupons.

I thought I could buy all right away, but it turns out, I can only buy one set of 5 coupons per day. Too bad. I spent like 90 huecomundo coins, just to have 30 coupons. Oh well, will take me around 2-3 days to get the necessary coupons

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-6 14:25:31

grimmjowpantera replied at 2015-4-6 13:43
weird. he does around more then my main. i guess mine is just super op. XD

What I dont like about grimmjow is that he's spirit blade. This means I have nobody to switch gears with him. Also, I hope he helps in instances, soulmap, etc.

I'd have to find a way to increase his strength drastically so he does more damage, because with low strength, his damage is useless in pvp at least.

author: lordsafak time: 2015-4-21 15:30:27

i was using komamura to lvl 100 and im get stark he is nice for now but i want try ichigo too

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-21 15:31:06

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-6 14:25
What I dont like about grimmjow is that he's spirit blade. This means I have nobody to switch gea ...

well you can still switch everything else but the weapon to another partner with grimm you just have to take 5 seconds to go switch stones from the weapon to another weapon.

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-21 15:36:40

grimmjowpantera replied at 2015-4-6 13:43
weird. he does around more then my main. i guess mine is just super op. XD

the way damage rate works is it applies your attack against the opponents partner defense then it takes the damage that would be done then multiplies it by the number above 100% for damage rate so for my grimm its 59% so say a grimm has 100k attack then it hits a van with 50k defense the game will register your attack doing 50k damage then it will multiply it by 59% and you will hit for 79500 damage after the damage rate is added in. Its a simple system to figure out if you test it once or twice.

author: llKhiz time: 2015-4-21 17:13:35

Quick question about Grimm.

I'm over halfway to getting him, but I just realized his skill is damage rate. My Zanpukto is Sogyo. Am I just wasting my time here like if I were to use my mains 9th skill?

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-21 20:00:12

llKhiz replied at 2015-4-21 17:13
Quick question about Grimm.

I'm over halfway to getting him, but I just realized his skill is damag ...

well damage rate and attack are different with sogyo you get a attack rate increase which is your normal attack without damage rate calculated in. So in short grimm will benefit from both effect since damage rate does stack while attack increases don't.

author: llKhiz time: 2015-4-21 20:04:32

elitegio replied at 2015-4-21 20:00
well damage rate and attack are different with sogyo you get a attack rate increase which is your ...

Thanks for the info brother

On the topic of Vanguards, any advice on Toshiro?

I have him but I realise now that he doesn't really suit my team and style (Sogyo as Zan running 1-3-1 with Isshin fueling the assaults and Rukia currently as support. Although once I hit 70 I'll bring in Yoruichi for pvp until I get some fury stones)

author: Leitzur time: 2015-4-21 23:53:28

elitegio replied at 2015-4-22 08:00
well damage rate and attack are different with sogyo you get a attack rate increase which is your ...

But how he does stack? Grim's damage rate acts as his base stats, not from skill buff isn't it? So it will be automatically added regardless

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-22 00:26:12

llKhiz replied at 2015-4-21 20:04
Thanks for the info brother

On the topic of Vanguards, any advice on Toshiro?

I personally don't have toshiro van but if your running a isshin and toshiro in the same formation they don't have anything to really complement each other and their cc don't exactly work well with each other either. The only one your going to be hitting with toshiro is the enemy van since isshin already has the enemy's assaulters locked out. So for toshiro go heavy attack while focusing on tons' of block rate so when the enemy van hits and supports hit it will do some serious damage to them on the return damage. and since sogyo already increases your van's atk damage its going to hurt alot if you go that route.

author: llKhiz time: 2015-4-22 00:32:53

elitegio replied at 2015-4-22 00:26
I personally don't have toshiro van but if your running a isshin and toshiro in the same formation ...

True

Sogyo also lessens the damage of the VG though by 40% just like almost every other Zanpukto out there.

I didn't really want Toshiro, but it was him or dark rukia and I figured Kisuke will be better in not too long anyway

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-22 00:42:44

Leitzur replied at 2015-4-21 23:53
But how he does stack? Grim's damage rate acts as his base stats, not from skill buff isn't it? So ...

what i met is damage rate will stack like when your using zabimaru you get both the passive damage rate increase from the zan as well as the zan skill damage rate increase and on top of that you get grimm's talent stack as well so that's about 169% if you have a set of 80 gear on grimm just in damage rate. As for sogyo you get the passive damage rate increase but then soygo increases your normal base damage so say you have 100k attack it will incease by 15% i believe giving you 115000 base attack but if you try stacking it with 9th skill it wont work the one with the higher % will overwrite the one with the lower % thus not stacking itself.
Also Grimm doesn't get a normal stat booster like ikkaku or kenpatchi he gets a damage rate boost of 15% for un-upgraded and 20% for upgraded its not like its a str boost of 15% so your working with a partner at his absolute base stats and as i stated before damage rate is calculated after the difference between defense and attack is found then it multiplies the remaining attack. So ya its automatic in terms of you not having to find the number yourself.

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-22 00:46:37

llKhiz replied at 2015-4-22 00:32
True

Sogyo also lessens the damage of the VG though by 40% just like almost every other Zanpukto ...

with lvl 8 str spirit stones it counters the 40% damage reduction but with what i think is the 15% increase to everyone's atk hes more like 25% reduction your working with. So its not as big of a gap as you think it is. Ya sure its noticeable compared to your other partners but the higher your van's attack the less your going to notice it in the long run because it only does so much in terms of gimping your van's attack. Not to mention the higher your str the more defence your going to get off of your stones as well as your attack so by increasing your attack through stones your going to be also making your van more physical attack defensive.

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-22 00:49:21

Edited by elitegio at 2015-4-22 00:51

Leitzur replied at 2015-4-22 00:50
so you mean grim users better use 8th skill for pve ?

if they are using soygo as a zan for pve yes they should use the 8th skill. If they aren't using soygo and using zabimaru then they should use 9th skill.

author: Leitzur time: 2015-4-22 00:50:06

elitegio replied at 2015-4-22 12:42
what i met is damage rate will stack like when your using zabimaru you get both the passive damage ...

anyway, is grim users better use 8th skill than 9th for pve ? if yes, i have to lvl up my 8th skill

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-22 00:55:44

Leitzur replied at 2015-4-22 00:50
anyway, is grim users better use 8th skill than 9th for pve ? if yes, i have to lvl up my 8th skill ...

If your using soygo then use you should be using your 8th skill instead of 9th. But if your using zabimaru you should be using 9th skill.

author: Leitzur time: 2015-4-22 00:56:48

elitegio replied at 2015-4-22 12:55
If your using soygo then use you should be using your 8th skill instead of 9th. But if your using ...

oh yes, i am using zangetsu so 9th skill for me

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-22 01:02:29

Leitzur replied at 2015-4-22 00:56
oh yes, i am using zangetsu so 9th skill for me

yes you should be using 9th skill...

author: Leitzur time: 2015-4-22 01:20:26

elitegio replied at 2015-4-22 13:02
yes you should be using 9th skill...

by the way, have you used nnoitra? i never really seen +recovery rate mod working for him, i thought it's like starrk / ichigo heals, or is that +recovery rate is for adding unohana's heals?

author: llKhiz time: 2015-4-22 01:31:17

Legendary. Thank you very much kind sir for all the information.

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-22 01:34:04

Leitzur replied at 2015-4-22 01:20
by the way, have you used nnoitra? i never really seen +recovery rate mod working for him, i thoug ...

yes i have nnoitra and his +recovery rate mod is only effected by healing thats incoming this also goes for self healing as well. So if your using ashisogi jizo its you get additional incoming healing as well or tengen.

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-22 03:07:40

elitegio replied at 2015-4-22 00:55
If your using soygo then use you should be using your 8th skill instead of 9th. But if your using ...

A friend in my server is doing lots of damage in ryoka and ES. His team is T1 rukia, kisuke, sexy yoroichi main and ikkaku for events. I asked him, his secret, and he told me he uses 8th skill with zabimaru.

He insists that I use 8th skill with my zabimaru, that my damage will increase a lot. Is this true? Should I use 8th skill with zabimaru? I've just read what you mentioned but this guy insists that I use 8th skill with zabimaru. Maybe it's because of my grimmjow.

Any comments?

author: Leitzur time: 2015-4-22 03:58:30

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-22 15:07
A friend in my server is doing lots of damage in ryoka and ES. His team is T1 rukia, kisuke, sex ...

Your friend got 3 fury boosters: sexy yoru, kisuke and rukia. most probably his team can make ikkaku skill every turn, with that skill combo and that team setup

author: elitegio time: 2015-4-22 12:39:24

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-22 03:07
A friend in my server is doing lots of damage in ryoka and ES. His team is T1 rukia, kisuke, sex ...

with 9th skill your raising the power of 3 partners so your increasing the damage across the board by a total of 45% every turn after compared to 100% every 2 turns with 8th skill. The only problem with this is if your in something like es where the pve can block and it blocks the partner your comboing with that 100% when blocked becomes 10% so instead of doing full damage across the board if you don't have the break stones to complement it, its going to do more damage then good. Ya sure if your using 8th skill on a partner with a combo rate your doubling the chances of that partner to combo as well but in a lot of cases its just not worth the risk. Its more safe to use 9th skill with zabimaru then 8th skill for consistency. I also personally don't use a normal pve formation compared to a lot of people and i also don't have any t1's in my formation and i only use 1 fury booster. The biggest thing you have to consider though is every team is going to be different and there's so many factors to take into account to work with. Personally i wouldn't go with 8th skill unless you have a ton of break def stones on your assault line. Its far more safe and consistent to stick with your 9th skill but nothing ventured nothing gained, if your really conflicted just take 1 day of pve and try it out. It took me several day's of trying it out in the past to figure out for my team and my personal preference its not worth the risk and chance of loss.

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-22 12:43:47

Leitzur replied at 2015-4-22 03:58
Your friend got 3 fury boosters: sexy yoru, kisuke and rukia. most probably his team can make ikk ...

I got SWP grimmjow, ikkaku, main (kido), kisuke and rukia. I don't have sogyo nor dark rukia. So this means that I should continue to use 9th skill? Or should I try 8th skill for events.

author: Leitzur time: 2015-4-22 14:05:38

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-23 00:43
I got SWP grimmjow, ikkaku, main (kido), kisuke and rukia. I don't have sogyo nor dark rukia. So ...

yeah you should stick with 9th skill. if you want to try 8th skill for events, try it at waves 50+

author: SosaRey time: 2015-4-22 22:49:07

Leitzur replied at 2015-4-22 03:58
Your friend got 3 fury boosters: sexy yoru, kisuke and rukia. most probably his team can make ikk ...

Ok what I just noticed is that his rukia is t1 and she attacks first giving fury to sexy yoroichi, which uses her skill which makes assaulters t1. So is it because of this that he does good damage in ES and ryoka with 8th skill and zabimaru?

author: Leitzur time: 2015-4-22 22:52:17

SosaRey replied at 2015-4-23 10:49
Ok what I just noticed is that his rukia is t1 and she attacks first giving fury to sexy yoroichi, ...

if he use 8th skill, he will get higher combo rate so that he can make either his assaulters or fury boosters get extra turn often

if his fury boosters have extra turn, they can give fury 2 or several times in 1 round, hence assaulter's fury will get filled up faster and ready to skill for next move

author: BlackTempets time: 2015-7-15 10:46:55

Sajin is bets

author: UchihaPapi time: 2016-7-4 17:17:01

I'd say nnoitra I used to use him before I made a god starrk and nnoitras 4th mod was really handy stunning people sometimes if they hit him

author: Ragnos time: 2016-7-4 19:38:55

this honeslty just depends on your formation

author: Shadow49999 time: 2016-7-5 08:13:52

Ragnos replied at 2016-7-4 19:38
this honeslty just depends on your formation

you damn niggas stop posting on threads that are older than a year the one asking probably quit already or has the answer to his/her question

Welcome to Bleach Online Forum (http://forums.gogames.me/)