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author: Aratron time: 2018-9-28 15:06:36 Title: Grwoth

Edited by Aratron at 2018-9-29 14:03

Till this very day i have no idea how the growth works. Can someone bring some clarity to me.

Starting stats and growth how it works.

I think I know how the growth works after some experiments.

+round[Lvl x (1+(growth/100))] per level - doesn't work that way

author: 15mdr02 time: 2018-9-28 20:43:09

As of now, I don't believe there is anyone who knows how the coding of this feature is designed. I have been doing a little bit of research on this but I still have a lot of samples that I need and a lot more time before I could offer any suggestions

author: Potdenutella time: 2018-9-29 05:53:34

(>+round[Lvl x1+(growth/100)]
Replace the +(growth/100) by *1.00XX (XX being the growth rate, let's say the partner have a growth of 7.5 just type *1.0075), shortcut the time it takes you to make a formula)

Nobody ? Guess I'll bite, I swear there are only around 5 mathematicians in this forum of hundreds of people...
I am bad at explaining but I will try, so sit down, take a cup of coffee or tea, listen to your favorite comfy music in a closed room and read carefully...

How do the Base Stats work ?

Many people says that if a partner has a base stat of 7000 STA he will start with 7000 STA, many says the base is only used for the growth rate etc... There are dozen of theories but none of them are true. In fact the base stat you see in the game and wiki is not the base but a multiplier. A multiplier of what you may ask ? Of coefficient, each class (Vanguard; Assaulter; Support) have different coefficients, for example a support has a higher coefficient of Wisdom than an assaulter, that's naturally logic.
Those are the coefficients for each class :

(From the top to bottom : STA; AGI; STR; WIS)
You may notice the numbers in brackets, unfortunately I couldn't exactly tell what are those, it's like a tumor in an human body... Let's just call it the "root" or whatever if you have a better name.The calculation is pretty simple, anyone with even an IQ of -5 can do it : ((Coef * Multip) + Root) = Base stat.
To make it easier, let's pick Handsome Toshiro, a red assaulter with 6000 STA as multiplier : ((2.6 * 6000) + 2048) = 17648. At level 1 Handsome Toshiro starts with 17648 of stamina.
Worry not I did not forget the talent, just calculate the base stat by the % from talent (let's say if he had 20% STA, 17648 * 1.2 = 21178 stamina).

Those are the partners with the stats at level 1, with the multiplier, growth and talent at the right, if you want to play around with the base stats (normal stats, no reiatsu).

What's so useful to know how the base stats work is that you can predict the stats of the future partners (Riruka) and confirm the value of the talent (It was stated for Raijin to have a talent of 25% or 35% AGI on the wiki but that didn't match the result I got so she has 30%, like Kokuto... It's probably a copypaste or typo from a wiki user, but it still can happen to have that kind of wrong value).

That's all about the base stats, you may wonder if you should say "multiplier" instead of "base" from now on but believe me those are just names and they are meaningless, a mathematician calls them whatever it sounds easy to understand for them. The forum's norm, or the community, is to continue saying "base" and not "multiplier" to ease the communication with the non-mathematician players. Perharp the appropriate names are : ((Multip * Base) + Root) = Starter stat. It's just that "coefficient" sounded cooler than "multiplier" to me lol

How does the Growth Rate work ?

Sorry to disappoint you but I don't know much, the closest formula for the growth is :
Level 1 : Stat 1 * Growth Rate = Stat 2
Level 2 : S2 * GR = S3
Level 3 : S3 * GR = S4
And so on... However it didn't seem linear, you have to add an extra value on some level and find the pattern, like :
Level 1 : S1 * GR = S2                            Level 1 : S1 * GR = S2
Level 2 : (S2 + 1) * GR = S3                   Level 2 : (S2 * GR) + 1 = S3
Level 3 : S3 * GR = S4                or       Level 3 : S3 * GR = S4
Level 4 : (S4 + 1) * GR = S5                   Level 4 : (S4 * GR) + 1 = S5

And of course you may need to find the coefficient, AKA the Stat 0 at level 0 (similar to some religion crap "What existed before the atoms, the universes ? Was there only void ? God created them all" kind of) in order to get the Stat 1 and start your math.
Here is the gain of stats at each level (yet looks crappy) with the difference between the two partners in the middle, if you want to play again, though it is easier to calculate with your own level 1 partner if you have one.

* The Growth Rate has no relation with the Base Stats
* The Growth Rate is affected by the talent (?)

author: Aratron time: 2018-9-29 06:50:33

Edited by Aratron at 2018-9-29 14:04

Potdenutella replied at 2018-9-29 12:53
(>+round[Lvl x (1+(growth/100))]
Replace the +(growth/100) by *1.00XX (XX being the growth rate, let's ...

Well, I think I'm good at maths for a nuclear engineer...

so don't worry...

That is phenomenal research I just don't want to invest so much time to check all this...

BIG THANKS.. ofc I'll check the validity of what you've said... :

author: jackthehorn time: 2018-9-29 07:13:07

In basic terms if you want to learn easy way. See the tavern gold partners. Turning red partners (not actually) with the red reshi results updated base rates. And not so changed growth rate.
If you can differentiate that you will understand easily. As if the growth changed then they will be become new partners since dmg to def, and att to counter all changes with that.

author: Aratron time: 2018-9-29 07:15:05

jackthehorn replied at 2018-9-29 14:13
In basic terms if you want to learn easy way. See the tavern gold partners. Turning red partners (no ...

I'm gonna do few experiments with Yoruichi from tavern she is gold now I'll level her up a little then I'll make her red and do that again... and will search some patterns...

author: Zento-Hazashi time: 2018-9-29 08:01:57

Aratron replied at 2018-9-29 11:50
Well, I think I'm good at maths for a nuclear engineer... so don't worry...

That is phenomenal ...

it's not valid if you find out Gold partners are worse than Red partners

author: Exalyn time: 2018-9-29 08:10:12

I did some experiment too, just a few nothing more.
The stat gain from a lvl to another is lvl AND growth rate related.
I picked the exemple between 2 chars with 0.5 growth rate difference, at same growth lvl (around 54 / 55) one gained like 17 agility more.
I also think there is another coefficient in there, maybe the one Pot highlighted there, difference between assaulters and supports idk.

author: Aratron time: 2018-9-29 08:24:04

Edited by Aratron at 2018-9-29 15:26

There is no logic what so ever up till now -Tavern Yoruichi

average growth per level       str:1,48%  agi:1,56% wis:1,59% stamina:1,49%
After becoming red  per level  str:1,81%  agi:1,88% wis:1,89% stamina:1,79%

Her stats, in general, had equal growth 32% after becoming red.

let's forget about her base stats and work with growth how and why?
from this  2,5  2,6  2,7  2,5 we double it as growth and get 0,32% growth per level up + to the previous

No logic at all previous stats*growth doesn't work even in growth/1000

We should all forget about the data they feed us. Take a few characters to level them up from lvl 1 to 100 and do our work on forging a formula

author: MylarHyrule time: 2018-9-29 09:06:43

Aratron replied at 2018-9-29 08:24
There is no logic what so ever up till now -Tavern Yoruichi

average growth per level str:1,4 ...

no good either... don't forget about many other bonuses your peeps get... I know I've seen many level 1 gold toshis with nothing on them over 30k BP... same story with D Rukias, Shinji, ect... hell, at this point, my Shura has nearly the BP he had when in my team, and hes got nothing on but an unleveled Aquaria set of gear...

On a side note, I'm seriously considering dropping my TSI for Shura again... I prob won't do it, but the want is real, lol

author: Aratron time: 2018-9-29 10:03:11

MylarHyrule replied at 2018-9-29 16:06
no good either... don't forget about many other bonuses your peeps get... I know I've seen many ...

I don't care what they have and how they got it, we speak just growth from x to x1 from lvl 60 to lvl 61 i have the stats data i don't care why is this much i care with how much it grows.

So technically when you double the stats and growth you should get double numbers. So good so far but you get 30ish % growth... WHY?

I use fresh tavern partner with nothing on it no bonuses whatsoever. The mod soul gives some attack def etc but not stats as agi,wis,str,sta...

author: Exalyn time: 2018-9-29 10:59:29

Rank arena give stats, but they are fix, not % related

author: theunknown404 time: 2018-9-29 12:51:41

Potdenutella replied at 2018-9-29 05:53
(>+round[Lvl x1+(growth/100)]
Replace the +(growth/100) by *1.00XX (XX being the growth rate, let's ...

Talent will affect the stat increases with each level just like spirit stones would.

author: theunknown404 time: 2018-9-29 12:59:17

My theory about stat increase per level is that it's like how Reiatsu increases stats with arbitrary number increases for each level. The growth rates of the character then affect how much that increase number is multiplied by similar to how zanpakuto bonus affects the growth of the Reiatsu bonus stats.

I have not tested this, but it seems possible since no simple pattern can be determined.

You would have to compare two naked partners and see how much they increase in STR, WIS, AGI, STA from level 1 upward and see if you an get a base number for each level between them (taking care to account for Talent differences as well as this will also affect the observed increases per level).

author: Aratron time: 2018-9-29 15:47:55

theunknown404 replied at 2018-9-29 19:59
My theory about stat increase per level is that it's like how Reiatsu increases stats with arbitrary ...

Reiatsu growth is linear, i posted about it table up to level 100 after that is kind of asymptotically tends to some maximum number.

About base stats and growth like i said we should assume everything we know is wrong and do our own research and see how and with how much (make formula) and do predictions and test it

author: adnane.bek time: 2018-9-29 17:59:41

Potdenutella replied at 2018-9-29 05:53
(>+round[Lvl x1+(growth/100)]
Replace the +(growth/100) by *1.00XX (XX being the growth rate, let's ...

potdenutella!!!!!

u succed on making a game a headache

a big thank for this sharing it is 12am too tired to read i'll crunch the numbers later big thanks

author: theunknown404 time: 2018-9-29 23:10:21

Aratron replied at 2018-9-29 15:47
Reiatsu growth is linear, i posted about it table up to level 100 after that is kind of asymptotic ...

I didn't meant to imply I thought it increased the exact same way. The amount of stats gained does generally increase over time, but it didn't seem like a very neat pattern. The gains stayed relatively the same for a number of levels for the characters I tested (starting from level 1). I even observed a gain go down once in value (?!?!). It's possible it becomes more variable as the level rises higher up.

I doubt they are using an exact formula for this. I had always worked on the assumption there was a formula behind it involving the base and growth together, but it's never turned up any pattern that can be modeled without a huge ass piecewise function. Hence, why I think there is a hint of purposeful arbitrariness involved in the numbers.

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